Profits4InvestingToo Revisited

I received an email recently concerning the failed HYIP/ponzi Profits4InvestingToo (P4I2). The email appears authentic. It was also sent to the email address which I used for Stormpay, so I assume that's where they got my contact email. Though P4I2 is long gone, it is only now that it seems the authorities are clamping down on its activities. Here's the email:

To: xxx

March 8, 2006

Greetings,

I am a detective assigned to the Major Crimes Unit of the Clark County Sheriff's Office, in Vancouver, Washington. I am currently working an investigation, along with other agencies, into alleged financial misconduct by, or involving, a subject named Edwin Garcia. Mr. Garcia is believed to be doing business under the following entities:

Profits4u
Offshoreprofits
P4itoo (profits4investingtoo)
Money4u

and other business entities. Some of these entities or investment businesses may have been active for relatively short periods of time (less than 60 days in some cases).

I am interested in speaking with you regarding investments you may have entrusted with this individual, or any of the listed businesses or any similar investment businesses. In particular, I am interested in knowing what promises or statements may have been made to you regarding returns on your investments, amounts invested or solicited, tiered payments made or promised, what lengths of time the investments were to be held, whether or not you actually received returns on any monies invested, and/or any other information you may be willing to provide.

I can usually be contacted Monday through Thursday, 0700 hrs to 1730 hrs Pacific Time. My direct telephone number is: (360) 397-2032. I can also be reached by pager (360) 759-8350) or FAX (360) 759-5491.

Your assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Kevin Harper
Detective 3216
Major Crimes Unit
Clark County Sheriff's Office
707 W. 13th St / PO Box 410
Vancouver, WA 98666
Kevin.harper@clark.wa.gov

When I first put money into Profits4InvestingToo (P4I2), I was new to the HYIP arena. However, I was savvy enough to know that most of these HYIPs were short term ponzis, with lifespans less than 1 month. Knowing that, my 'investment' in P4I2 was minimal, using Stormpay's Stormclix earnings only. It was, in my eyes, a pure gamble. I never expected a return. Yet, 1 month later, after I placed a request, I got paid. Since it was such a small amount, Stormpay fees took a large portion of the money - about 20%.

Now, if I had not received any payment from P4I2, chances are, my account would still be active. However, since I did receive something from P4I2, Stormpay has since charged back the money (the total sent, not the total received, meaning they pocket the difference), and suspended my account.

I am trying to decide how to respond to the official email. As far as I'm concerned, it was a gamble on my part, not an investment. Most of these ponzi/HYIPs use the Goldcoders HYIP script, which looks like this. By default, the text states something that implies some form of investment in forex and stocks, and if I recall correctly, P4I2 didn't change anything, except for the % returns.

The term 'ponzi' implies that new investors are used to pay off the old, without any real investment. For any online HYIP offering daily, weekly or monthly returns, some of the money WILL have to come from new members. Otherwise, it'll be a transaction nightmare. So, does that make all online HYIPs ponzis? OR does this only apply if more than 50% of payments are made using money from new investors? The legal definitions vary from country to country. It isn't a clear-cut case of black or white.

No, the problem with online HYIPs, is regulation. Or rather, the lack of. Something which the authorities want to change. To control. To tax.

Reasons why Stormpay will suspend your account

If you look through Stormpay's website, you should be able to find this info.

Reasons an account may be Suspended?
Closing accounts and limiting account access: StormPay Inc. reserves the right to limit access to purchasing or making withdrawals from an account for any one of the events listed below. In the event your account access is restricted, all funds within the account will be held for a period of 180 days to cover against any chargebacks your account may incur. After 180 days of account restriction, you may contact StormPay Inc. to request the balance of any remaining funds held within your StormPay account.
See reasons below:
1. Reports of unauthorized or unusual bank account use associated with the account:
2. Reports of unauthorized or unusual credit card use associated with the account including, but not limited to, notice by the card issuing bank. This includes notices made by you to your credit card company that a transaction was unauthorized or your account compromised, and is done in order to protect you from further unauthorized use of your card:
3. Abuse by a buyer of the reversal process provided by the buyer's issuing bank:
4. Complaints received regarding non-shipment of merchandise, non-delivery of services, merchandise not as described, or problems with merchandise shipped:
5. Receipt of potentially fraudulent funds:
6. Refusal to cooperate in an investigation or provide confirmation of identity when requested:
7. Initiation by a buyer of a reversal process through the buyer's issuing bank without first pursuing the vendor or StormPay Inc. to satisfy the situation:
8. Opening multiple StormPay accounts:
9. The account has been used in or to facilitate fraudulent activity:
10. Name on the bank account does not match the name on the StormPay account or does not relate to the name on the StormPay account:
11. Return of an incoming Electronic Funds Transfer for insufficient funds in the bank account, incorrect bank routing number, or incorrect bank account number:
12. Receipt by StormPay of excessive complaints regarding your account, business or service:
13. Use of an anonymizing proxy:
14. Logging in from any country on StormPay's non-approved country list: 15. Initiation of transactions considered to be cash advances or assisting in cash advances.
16. Sending unsolicited email or posting referral links on websites where they are not permitted.
17. Any violations of the StormPay user agreement. … Read More

While it may be true that other payment processors have similar terms and conditions regarding fraud & other illegal activity, it is in the implementation of Stormpay's policies that has everyone in uproar.

For those who have even a single transaction with an autosurf or HYIP, this means that your accounts will be frozen (if they aren't yet, they will be). It doesn't matter if
the transaction was for less than $5. Or, that your dabble in said autosurf/HYIP was over 6 months ago. Even if the majority of your transactions are legitimate, your entire account balance will be frozen.

I wonder if anyone's keeping track of the number of suspended Stormpay accounts.
100,000? 300,000? 500,000? More?

Stormpay Account Suspended

Oh look! My Stormpay account got suspended. Finally. Yes, It is true that I had an account balance of -$5.36. And it was an unverified account, because I didn't trust Stormpay enough to give them my bank account details.
But, I didn't bring my account into the red. They did. With a chargeback.





I wonder how many accounts are in a similar boat because of Stormpay chargebacks.

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